I tried Wynnes Valve Treatment on mine too.

It's not made the slightest bit of difference.Just learned to live with it.


Regards.

 

I've been told that if the lifters are the problem then the excess fuel will seep down to piston taking away the oil and aging the engine quicker. I really don't want to have to live with it.

 

Can't see how that works. Think you are miss informed.

 

Have you tried an engine flush and refill using Castrol Magnatec? - not forgetting a new filter as well of course.

 

Engine flush is on the cards when the weather picks up, although the place where I got it from said they had changed the oil and filter. The oil is still a bronze colour but I take your point as the deposits may not have been cleared. Strange that it happens when warm though.

 

If it annoys you that much you could get a new set of lifters, I replaced mine when the head gasket now and it's loads for it. About £60 a set if I recall + quite a lot of labour (didn't fancy doing that bit myself).

 

I have noticed there seems to be an oil leak from the cam gasket. Could this affect the oil pressure going to the lifters? although if it does woundn't it make this tapping noise from start up?

All help appreciated.

 

I have noticed there seems to be an oil leak from the cam gasket. Could this effect the oil pressure going to the lifters? lthough if it does woundn't it make this tapping noise from start up?

All help appreciated.

I suppose in theory it could reduce it as certainly the pressure at the top of the head is lower...

I would keep a very close eye on where the leak is going though; when mine was leaking it ran along the seam and dropped off the end... onto the alternartor belt which then snapped some miles later (thankfully no doing any other damage, although they may take other stuff out with them hence the warning).

 

Thanks derek_bartram I think if I can determine that it is the lifters and nothing else then I may consider changing the lifters. Any idea how much it would cost for someone else to do it? as I probably won't have the time until later in the summer (if we have one)

.

 

Any idea how much it would cost for someone else to do it?

I'm not sure. I posted my head off, the refurbed it (strip, degrees, new valves, new springs, new caps, new lifters, skim, and assembly) for £300ish... that was with me removing and fitting head though.

 

thanks for the warning derek_bartram I'll check out underneath it.

 

I brought a cam gasket which I will fit when I get it and the time. I'm going to try the cheap options first before I opt for the more expensive ones

.

Any other ideas what might be causing the problem. I am still not sure why it happens once it has warmed up. If it is left standing for a day the tapping occurs once it is warmed up and if I use it at any other point during that day the tapping remains. Strange considering the oil would have been expelled from the lifters when then engine is off which would usually cause the tapping to occur as soon as it starts while the lifters fill up.:dunno:

 

Any other ideas what might be causing the problem.

*complete and utter guess...
The oil becomes more viscous as it warms up - perhaps the oil pump has a slight leak back past it; as the oil becomes more viscous more can leak back past reducing oil pressure and resuling in the lifters not getting a good supply?

 

Thats an interesting theory derek_bartram

, if it is the internal pipe works that are leaking then I assume a good old fashioned compression test could be used?
I'm going to be giving it a compression test anyway so this will give me something to think about, cheers derek_bartram.

 

Appologies derek_bartram I re-read your post and I assume you are talking about the pump itself and the seals making it less effective in pumping the oil up through the channels? How could I diagnose it I wonder...

 

Yes, was talking about oil pump.... it's a pretty wild guess though. Having looked around some of the elise performance parts sites there's one that suggests an updated oil pump cog thing, hence the thought. I don't think you could diagnose that.

Might be worth a PM to Jon Norris or Kayliegh (Dave's partner) as they could probably point you in the right direction.

 

Personally if I bought a car and somebody told me they just changed the oil I would still change it myself anyway, especially a k series and a VVC at that since from what I have read they seem even more fussy about their oil.

I put cheap 10w 40 oil in my ZS and it used to have a very tappy ticking noise that got worse when hot so a few months later I changed the oil again to Castrol Magnatec and it made a huge difference, sounded much better and no ticking noise, when I sold it 6 months later to somebody who claimed to know Rovers, he said it sounded sweet and you wouldn't think it had done 111k.

Even thought they told you they changed the oil they could have used some cheap rubbish and do you even know they used the correct grade? I was told by a couple of garages to used 5w30 fully synthetic in the ZS and if not for finding this site I probably would have done what they said, I also knew a mechanic once and all he would use was 15w40 mineral oil because he got it cheaper and insisted it made no difference.

I'm as far from an expert as you can get and this is just my experience.

 

Personally if I bought a car and somebody told me they just changed the oil I would still change it myself anyway, especially a k series and a VVC at that since from what I have read they seem even more fussy about their oil.

I put cheap 10w 40 oil in my ZS and it used to have a very tappy ticking noise that got worse when hot so a few months later I changed the oil again to Castrol Magnatec and it made a huge difference, sounded much better and no ticking noise, when I sold it 6 months later to somebody who claimed to know Rovers, he said it sounded sweet and you wouldn't think it had done 111k.

Even thought they told you they changed the oil they could have used some cheap rubbish and do you even know they used the correct grade? I was told by a couple of garages to used 5w30 fully synthetic in the ZS and if not for finding this site I probably would have done what they said, I also knew a mechanic once and all he would use was 15w40 mineral oil because he got it cheaper and insisted it made no difference.

I'm as far from an expert as you can get and this is just my experience.

Yep a oil change is on the cards, just waiting for the weather. My TF is not a vvc (as far as I'm aware). The tapping is as loud as Gordon in the utube clip I would be amazed if the change of oil would sort it out. Heres hoping

.

 

I assume that the oil level is OK?

 

yep, between the min and max.

 

Let me know how you get on with getting rid of the ticking noise

 

I put the hydrolic lifter treatment in with the engine oil about 400 miles ago and it seemed to stop the tapping every now and then. Some times it would tap and other times it would not. But recently, within the last two weeks it seems to still tap when warmed up. I still have not changed the oil which will be done this week. I am changing the cam gasket too as I believe it is leaking very slightly.

 

mines exactly the same, sinces its been a bit cooler the past couple of days the ticking noise has dissapeared, im going to changed the alternator belt and change the plugs this weekend so il have a look at it then, cheers for that

 

Sounds a lot like lifters to me.

 

Yep the lifters are not getting enough oil making them noisey but the key is finding out why they are not getting enough oil. Blocked oil ways seem to be the most common so lifter cleaner sometimes help, also the wonderous properties of magnetec as well as other less common reasons that have been discussed here. Hopefully I'll get the time to sort it out.

 

The oil feed to the lifters is via grooves cast or machined into the top half of the cam carrier. If the head has been stripped in the past and the mechanic(?) has been heavy handed with the sealant on the cam carrier/head joint then these grooves can become blocked or restricted which will result in poor oil supply to one or more lifters and hence the tappity noises.

It may be worth stripping the cam carrier off the head to check and reseal the joint properly with the correct sealant (anaerobic type). Whilst doing this you could also remove the cams to replace the lifters, replace the cam belt, tensioner and water pump thus giving you real knowledge of the status of these items rather than relying on whatever the seller claims. :broon:

One of the forum's mobile mechanics would be good to do this for you rather than using a possibly unknown garage.

 

Sounds like a good plan. I'll be replacing the cam gasket when I do the oil change as it is leaking so I'll give the oil ways a check while I'm there. cheers

 

Which gasket are you anticipating changing? There is no gasket as such between the cam carrier and the head, ie sandwiching the cams, it's metal to metal with just a very thin layer of the special sealant.

The only gasket in the area is a coated metal sheet and goes between the next layer up, ie above the top half of the cam carrier and the final outer cam cover.

 

The only gasket in the area is a coated metal sheet and goes between the next layer up, ie above the top half of the cam carrier and the final outer cam cover.[/QUOTE]

Thats the gasket that will be changed. Surely this will give me a insight to the condition of the top of the cams?

 

Yes you can see the cams but that's all.

To check the oilways you need to get to the next joint down and that will require removing the cambelt and top half cam carrier and only then can you see if any oilways are choked.

You will need to do this too to remove the cams to get the lifters out.

 

Thanks for the heads up. How much do the mobile mechanics cost to do this work?

 

Im going to replace my lifters on my 98 VVC also due to the tappy sound. The difference with mine was that using standard 10/40 oil for halfords i never got the sound. The moment i changed to Magnatec the sound appeared. I have not tried with standard oil again but seems strange how it occured the moment i changed oil. Iv flushed the oil and refilled with magnatec and still the same issue.

 

From what I understand the VVC is prone to this type of noise and have not seen anyone correct the noise on this engine yet. Let me know if the change of lifters work

 

My 135 does the same, it still taps on ocassions when the engine is warm.

It seems very common with the K series engine, I have had a full service not long ago with a complete oil change. It does sound like the lifters is at fault here, but why does this seem a common issue, is the engine weak in this area?

 

I get the same thing on my VVC. When it's started it sounds humble. After a good drive and when it's warn you get a ticking noise that's louder on some days than others. I notice that's it's much louder if say I've just ragged it home. Going to try the lifter treatment. Switching to mag oil made no difference.

 

Same here. My friends mock me for having a diesel convertible.

I recently put some Wynns valve treatment stuff and it sounds better after (although this may be in my head only). I'm OK with the noise though.

I'm currently using ESSO 5W40 and that may contribute to the noise. I'm waiting for the next service to put some 10W40, semisynthetic oil.

Cheers,
Dan

 

When I had my head gasket replaced recently I asked about the "tappety" noise from the engine when it's hot.

Apparently it can be caused by a noisy VVC unit (which I believe is bloody expensive to replace)

A bit of info on the workings of the VVC unit here. http://www.sandsmuseum.com/cars/elise/thecar/engine/vvcrover.html

 

There is a specific problem called the VVC rattle of doom/death, that every connoisseur VVC owner dreads. However, the noise caused by this issue is quite specific and strong. In my experience, (which is not a lot), you can hear a distinct metallic knock.

Even when functioning correctly, the VVC mechs are noisier than the standard MPI stuff. Thus, the tappety noise, which is not an automatic prediction of fiery death and failure.

 

I don't think it's just the vvc that suffers, my 135 does the tapping noise as well, it does seem common with the K series, although my mates 1.8 ZT, runs sweet as a nut