[alanaslan]

Life was so much simpler back in the seventies when we measured the power out put at the wheels. I remember owning a triumph 2000 which had its power measured at the wheels then two years the cars were being advertised with around 18% more power than mine on close inspection the difference was caused by the new car being measured at the flywheel whilst my girl was measured at the wheels after passing through the auto box down the prop shaft through the diff and finely at the wheels. Who is to say which is correct but they are apples and oranges.


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[alanaslan]

Back in the day all cars had bhp and torque measured at the wheels. Makes sense as that is what you are actually driving with. In the early seventies motor companies started giving power ratings at the flywheel. This has to be measured on a test rig engine out.
The Auto box has p,r,n,4,3,2. Well that is the writing. The number you select to the maximum gear the box will go up to when in use. You will all have the signs on our roads change into low gear. In the auto box you can still do this by selecting either 3 or 2 giving you engine breaking. Then you have S and E modes the difference there is the point on the power curve the gear box will change up the gears. Ie holding the the car in a lower gear before activating the gear change perhaps 1200rpm more reves till the upchange occurs. Thus holding the car on the torque band for longer but not always on the power band. I hope this helps with the testing with the auto box.
I think you have got your whiskey drinker sorted to give you the best of both worlds having a good power and torque output smooth gear changes still with a beast under your right foot when you want it and better mpg or km/l than before you started.
Very impressive graphs for a 2.5 whiskey drinker with an auto box.
One of my young friends used to work in a distillery he always maintained the best cleaning agent was the stuff they made. He was not a whiskey drinker but bottled the early sprit off the still for cleaning down the lines and equipment. Most of the early stuff is just dumped. I would love to know how much that actually is across the industry as a whole, I suspect enough to run the remaining fleet of petrol Rovers still in use and still some left over.
That to me is a tragic waste of a resource that we have but don’t use.

 

[Dorchester]

Very true. Car builders nowadays are giving deceiving information: one of the 'best' fraud scheme so far was the dieselgate...
Alcohol indeed is a very efficient cleaner but not as aggressive as some are pretending. Just a very good cleaner but nothing to be compared with acid. So many humbugs are circulating on the web propagated by poor souls who don't know anything nor understand a jot about what they are spreading...
What a shame what you tell us about the early Whisky stuff: alas I know the fact for I used to make plum brandy in the 90s when I lived near Saint-Antonin Noble Val. We had plum trees galore on our chalky soil and sun as well. Don't forget the area is well know in France for its prune production.
BTW I do enjoy from time to time a good lump of Scottish whisky: I particularly appreciate those single malts produced in some islands with their gorgeous peaty smell: Mull, Islay, Jura and Orkney... 🤪

 

[Dorchester]

Good news & bad news.
Let's be positive & begin with the bad ones.

My 6 CD changer is definitely out of order: it doesn't want to open most of the time, and didn't want to work properly & read all the cds a few days ago and now doesn't want to read any any more. I hope a very well famed seller on the other forum will be able to help me because a few sellers here in France don't look very reliable. The only one who offers a guarantee that his item is 100% operational is selling it 60€ + shipping, which looks on the steep side. Anyway that one may be a valuable contender if my British seller cannot provide me with a good certified one.
I don't want to be deprived of a CD changer: it's precisely for that reason that I kept my genuine then up-market radio and to keep stock all the features inside the cabin.

Another plague: since 2 days the car is making a very tiresome noise, but nothing to do directly with the engine that works perfectly. Moreover that nuisance is rather a kind of unpleasant even not very loud vibration, a disagreeable resonating frequency. It seems coming from the low part of the bonnet, like under my feet and is not permanent: only when accelerating at some revs or when the engine is submitted to a heavy load when driving uphill and only at some revs.
It looks like it's coming not from the engine but somewhere between the exhaust manifold and the beginning of the full SS exhaust line recently fitted. But I can't see any wrong when lying on the ground I'm looking under the car: nothing looks out of place, and nothing as well from under the bonnet. I suspect something touching the exhaust system or maybe a kind of clamp not tight enough and loosened by the uneven roads & awful bumpers.

To be continued...

 

[Dorchester]

Anybody hearing of a gremlin in the glove box?
Going at the garage and willing to make some pics of the cd changer front part, I ventured to push on the green button and hey presto did the cartridge eject itself!
I put an only cd inside the rack and put it back into the changer. all the testing operations did well and the 'digit' placed itself in front of the only cd. I asked for a reading of every track with the 'SND' option and it worked.
Then I pushed upon the green button and once more the cartridge got out at once!
Hence I put in place the whole bunch of 6 cd that refused to play since the beginning of the week along our trip.
I asked for a reading of every track of every cd from the first one to the last one: all went fine!
So what???
An idea? I noticed that never since 2017 I'd shut the sliding door of the cd changer... Did it suffer a cold?
A whim of the sound system?
Thus I shut it. Let's see what will happen now next time when I drive the car...
Any idea will be warmly welcome about that very weird behaviour... Thanks! 🤪

 

[Dorchester]

A very generous offer Andy made me for his 6 CD changer: he asked only for the mere shipping price!
It reminds me of a high-ranking chap of this forum who was very generous to offer me for free a much coveted armrest...
Anyway the CD changer was fully working when he took it off but just in case he'll test it tomorrow: fingers crossed...
I'm definitely a happy bunny. And would Andy's CD changer be out of order, I've reserved my definite answer to the French one until tomorrow afternoon.

Let's now talk about the positive side of our trip provided we don't tackle the weather problem...
I'm chuffed with the remap: the torque curve is far more linear since say around 1.5k revs and I can't actually feel the big gap there was previously between before and after 3k revs. The smooth and nonetheless very efficient and responsive acceleration is a delight mainly on twisted & hilly country roads and they were many where we spent our 'working' week! No longer any feeling of weakness in those hard situations within low revs, the KV6 2.5 not being really at ease out of large roads & motorways in the first place.

Regarding the mpg it's hard to make a fair & right comparison several parameters being different.
First the ambient temperature was sensibly lower than in our area. Then except the first trip on Sunday and back home on the following Friday, along 4 days we made relatively short journeys with several stops and starts along the day (hardly more than 50km / 30mls all of a piece) a little more than I do usually. At last lots of country roads we drove along were winding and sometimes very 'slopy' and incidentally at a slightly higher altitude. Four reasons which might have explained a rather lesser mpg.
Result: despite the relatively unhelpful conditions it looks I've consumed the same amount of petrol as usual: 23.14 mpg / 12.21 l (road cruising) - 21.85 mpg / 12.93 l (hilly & twisted country roads) - 23.02 mpg / 12.27 l (with a part of motorways), the average being around 22.7 mpg / 12.5 l since 4 years (and even 21.8 mpg / 12.9 l for the 10 last fuel ups). Thus no miracle but an indisputable driving improvement without any noticeable mpg deterioration.

Just now to tackle that harassing & disturbing vibration frequency...

 

[Dorchester]

Well despite some are obviously spending nice holidays (but where? cold & rainy here, dreadful fires there and C19 everywhere... ), I'm nevertheless nurturing the topic.
I've forgotten two major events which took place in our recent trip.

Let's begin by the one which could have been the death knell of Lady Carlotta...
Driving fast (but legally fast... 80mph) on the motorway, suddenly a deer jumped through the left opposite part (we are driving on the right part here) but stopped immediately between both crash barriers when our 75 was exactly at its height!
Then we passed (I haven't even had the time to brake or to be frightened so sudden it was) and immediately the deer jumped again just behind our car while crossing the second part of the motorway.
But what happened? A miracle? A sudden adoration for Lady Carlotta from the deer?
The car driver behind us was utterly gobsmacked at the sight of the scene told me my better half!
But what happened?
Both my ultrasonic whistles glued on each side mirror played their full part and saved our day thanks to God!

The second was music to my ears. When we arrived at the château du Fraisse, we were alone and were welcomed by the lord himself, Louis Marquess des Monstiers-Mérinville, coming to us and saying immediately: "I love your car!" Such was his admiration that he repeated it a second time after some welcoming words: "I love your car!"
That's what I call a man of great taste!

 

[Dorchester]

Today was MOT day for Lady Carlotta.
All is well that ends well: she's safe for 2 years more despite 4 minor advisories.

Two of them are exactly the same at every control:
1. the fog lamps don't look too well orientated but nobody can do anything about it for both of them aren't adjustable.
2. their machine cannot be safely connected to the OBD plug to test the exhaust fumes. Don't ask me why!

The other ones which are new:
3. An hairline crack in the right fog lamp but it reads that it doesn't prevent the shining of the bulb. Hence nothing.
4. The most preposterous one I should have tested before going to the MOT: one of the two bulbs that are lighting the rear plaque is out of order. The problem is that the plasma screen in front of the driver detects every failure on every bulb (I know that, and it scares me when that happens!) but on the plaque where both bulbs need to be out of order to be reported. It may be a bad contact as well: I'd noticed the problem before because there was a bit of an old corrosion on the contacts. As soon as I'd touched the bulb it was shining again. I'll have a close look on the following days, easy peasy with WD40.

 

[gnu]

Well done, always a relief to get the certificate! 😁

 

[Dorchester]

Don't you want to know which is the oldest part in Lady Carlotta?
The rear plaque bulb I've just fitted in the afternoon!
It's coming from a 'new old stock' - as they say - which dates from the 80s I'd got on the shelf, and mind that it's not the oldest spare bulb in my garage: nothing was written on it but it was in a set which reads "12v" and the shape & size being the right ones, that wasn't a big risk... And it works fine!
And there are still some other boxes that were intended to be used for my first cars in the 70s... (Renault 5 TL and Peugeot 104 ZS...). At last some 6V for my old Citroën 2CV (I'd had 2 of them) might be found somewhere as well... it's not impossible... It's incredible how conservative I am (and my parents were) despite a few removals... 🤪

 

[alanaslan]

Good news & bad news.
Let's be positive & begin with the bad ones.

My 6 CD changer is definitely out of order: it doesn't want to open most of the time, and didn't want to work properly & read all the cds a few days ago and now doesn't want to read any any more. I hope a very well famed seller on the other forum will be able to help me because a few sellers here in France don't look very reliable. The only one who offers a guarantee that his item is 100% operational is selling it 60€ + shipping, which looks on the steep side. Anyway that one may be a valuable contender if my British seller cannot provide me with a good certified one.
I don't want to be deprived of a CD changer: it's precisely for that reason that I kept my genuine then up-market radio and to keep stock all the features inside the cabin.

Another plague: since 2 days the car is making a very tiresome noise, but nothing to do directly with the engine that works perfectly. Moreover that nuisance is rather a kind of unpleasant even not very loud vibration, a disagreeable resonating frequency. It seems coming from the low part of the bonnet, like under my feet and is not permanent: only when accelerating at some revs or when the engine is submitted to a heavy load when driving uphill and only at some revs.
It looks like it's coming not from the engine but somewhere between the exhaust manifold and the beginning of the full SS exhaust line recently fitted. But I can't see any wrong when lying on the ground I'm looking under the car: nothing looks out of place, and nothing as well from under the bonnet. I suspect something touching the exhaust system or maybe a kind of clamp not tight enough and loosened by the uneven roads & awful bumpers.

To be continued...

If you are stuck I should have one somewhere in the garage I will have a look on Sunday morning presently a third of the garage is not assessable my daughter bought a “new” house four and a half years ago so her young son would have a garden they are still living in their old house as whilst we managed to retain the original 17th Century cottage has been fully refurbished. The remaining two thirds of the house had to be taken down and rebuilt on a steel erection built on piles. The Garage and the two back bedrooms are being used as storage at the moment. If I find the cd changer drop me your address and it will magically arrive at your door.
We are meant to be downsizing perhaps next year.
Alan

 

[Dorchester]

Thank you so much for your so kind proposal @alanaslan.
But Andy Brown (Trikey) from the other forum has already provided my need with his old CD changer which is in very good condition and fully operational. I had only to give him back the shipping price. A gentleman like you.
Nevertheless at the moment my CD changer is back in service and working again, don't ask me why or how!
Hence now I've got a good one on the shelf just in case for peace of mind... I'm a happy bunny!
I wish your daughter & your grandson a happy removal. Lucky they are to live in the best part of an original 17th Century cottage.

 

[Dorchester]

Like our mate @Spudgun! I was thinking about my fuel consumption... How amazing... on the same day!
But I can't actually compare with every same parameter on the same road.
I'm relying on an average mpg on the long run, but what for?
I would be very interested in knowing whether my last remap on the 22 July last was an 'economical' move or not.

Anyway I'm very happy with it: better torque in the low revs, more oomph when driving, more regular torque curve so that I can no longer feel the then difference around 3.0/3.5k revs when the VIS motors are coming to life. And I guess a bit more power (at least I was told so: +6 bhp at the flywheel) would I fancy to make a test on a race circuit... 🤪
According to the first 5 fuel ups after the remap I'm averaging a 22.1 mpg (12.78 L/100 km). But since 4 years I was doing around 22.6 mpg (12.5 L/100 km). Don't forget than that is the equivalent of 28 mpg (10 L/100 km) of E5 at least. And the auto box isn't helping but I'm so comfy & relax not to use my left foot any more! 😊
So not convincing regarding the so called remap fuel economy.
I'm wondering whether I'm not taking too much advantage of my new opportunities... 😜

 

[alanaslan]

We all seem to be doing the same thing at the same time, I managed to boot up an old laptop in February and load up some of my old pit software. ( No the Gentleman in Aberdeen who borrowed my tough book almost four years ago now has not returned it and I am unable to contact him)
Anyway I treated the spice tourer to + 22bhp and the wife’s to +15 bhp. Spice is using more fuel about town about 2mpg not so good it was an easy upgrade as it had a Rover brain for its M47R engine.
Last weekend we got out for the first time in 18 months and she got to stretch her wheels, we were at a weeding. 120 miles each way. No rush so driving on the foot and not using the magic button. She gave up 46mpg a big improvement on the 41 she used to give.
The wife’s saloon has been kidnapped by my son, but before the kidnap it was improved from 33.4mpg running about to 36.1mpg averaged over 2000 miles. So a much more fuel efficient remap.
It was a sod of a job though it’s brain was a BMW one had to copy the map strip out all the code stoping the remap change the map and put back the code. Would almost have been easier fitting a common rail pressure booster box to the end of the rail. My son has been given strict instructions to record fuel fills. It will be interesting to see what his driving does to the mpg. At the beginning of the pandemic I did notice that the cars were not doing so well, but on speaking to the owner of the filling station we use he told me that due to the slump in diesel sales he had not filled his tanks for almost five months and it was still winter diesel we were getting from the pumps.
I had not realised that the filling stations were getting a anti wax diesel in the winter months. That will save me a bit as from November to May I had been using an anti wax treatment on every tank fill. The stuff I use doesn’t stop the diesel waxing but prevents the wax forming a polymer chain and so prevents blockages in the lines all very clever stuff. I have no idea what is added to the delivery tankers or how it works. Something to investigate.
Alan


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[Dorchester]

Well done with your remaps.
But you've got diesel cars and I was told only diesel and turbo cars should get a sensible remap.
For petrol engines like my V6 the bhp benefit is rather marginal and the only visible effect is a better torque in the low revs.
The best news is at last you were able to get out for the first time in 18 months: you might have ended as a monk in a monastery along that long period!
Never I could have waiting so long and never my 3 Rovers were inactive even when we were to remain in a more restricted spot, but I'm living in the country and it's much easier than in an urban area.

 

[alanaslan]

Now I am pulling on knowledge that I had thirty years ago. Franek and Tim were to of the best engine techs I knew from my engineering days at Le-mans and Spa. These lads could increase the performance of a petrol engine in some cases by as much as 50%. They could even upload upgrades to the cars during refuelling and tyre pit stops. The trick was to compile the code in such a way that a correctly configured ECU could unpack the upgrade whilst still performing its function.
They were able to download at one pit stop the condition and wear of critical engine parts from oil samples and sensors located in different components. This allowed them to make changes to the the cams hydraulics and ignition timing. Fuel and air mixtures as well as turbine pressures being supplied to the engine and waste gates.
I never fully understood their coding, as they thought in 1s and 0s. I needed to see the code complete with REM lines to make some sort of sense. Both the boys had a understanding of how these high performance engines which could be running at maximum power for the whole time that the vehicle was not braking or in the pits which could be for Twenty two and a half hours out of twenty four. Their job was to ensure the engine power out put was the same on the last lap of the race as it was on Wednesday and Thursday Qualifying.
These guys were brilliant and were always working for one of the teams in LMP1 or LMP2 generally whoever was paying the most that year, They were self employed and only ever signed a contract for a maximum of one year.
I wish I still kept in close contact with them as they have forgotten more than most people will ever know.


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[Dorchester]

A lovely day today at last: sun was shining despite a rather chilly temperature at 9 o'clock: 3°.
It was our club annual meeting: despite the dreaded pandemic 40 people attended out of 104.
Driving the 75 for the first time since 5 weeks was a very bliss: still smooth and very reactive & torquey now in the low revs thanks to the recent remap. No longer any hole before 3k revs and immediate power on demand even going uphill. A dream...
Gathering in a well famed and nice restaurant very close to Gaillac, Tarn.

You may judge that her majesty 75 was in very good company: Lambo Murcielago mk1 and Chevrolet Corvette... among lots of others.

The happy owner of the Lamborghini owns as well: a Jaguar E-type, a Jaguar 420 Sovereign, a Bentley and I've forgotten another one... sorry!

Good mood, fine humour and good meal & wines: what's better to end up a year with?

 

[gnu]

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View attachment 137415

Good mood, fine humour and good meal & wines: what's better to end up a year with?

Nice meet and cars. Three primary colours as well. 🌈

 

[Dorchester]

Three primary colours as well. 🌈

Blimey I hadn't notice that! Very good point!

 

[Dorchester]

I fear I might slightly ramble but I'm still chuffed about my lovely 75! How amazing...
Here are the figures taken by Torque on the fly while I was overtaking and kicking down yesterday.
And mind that each time I'm kicking down I get a rough kick in the ass: it pulls hard and sudden!
Mind the headache!

To make a long story short at 6,535 revs I reached 129.41 hp at the wheels (I assume there might exist a very short delay - around 1 sec. - between the maximum power and the higher revs.
129.41 hp is equal to 127.64 bhp at the wheels.
Besides I understand that Rover 75 V6 2.5 engine efficiency (engine optimisation rating) is 72% as you may find at Specs Rover 75 2.5 V6 Auto 177 ps and as I was told on the 75 & ZT owners club website.
Then by a very easy rule of three 127.64 bhp at the wheels gives 177.277 bhp at the crank, that is the actual engine power and that looks the exact maximum engine power genuinely given by Rover!

Nevertheless back to the official remap figures given last summer, the pros got a better result on their dyno:

• before the remap 140.48 bhp at the wheels (6717 revs) hence 191.740 bhp at the crank,
• after the remap 146.202 bhp at the wheels (6277 revs) hence 198.250 bhp at the crank.

That difference might be solved because the conditions were different (on the road / on the bench) and that Torque may likely be not that bad but slightly approximate and delayed.
BTW I'm told that fuelled up by E85 (octane 105) and with my different mods (air intake box admitting more air, K&N filter & derestrictive SS exhaust line) TBH my engine should drive a tad better than in the first place.

How does that sound?