[rfrancis475]

Evening, just seeing if anyone can give me opinions on what I should do.

My 25 has been losing a small amount of coolant, max to min top up every 3-4 weeks.

Took it in on Tuesday and left it with them, told them about the gasket change 9000 miles ago. Coolant colour all good, no mayo under the filler cap and runs smooth with no overheating. Also told them that it looks like an external leak as I have noticed coolant colour droplets occasionaly collecting on the sump cover.

They phoned me four hours later and told me it was leaking from the head gasket and that it would need replacing. Reluctantly and after a think I decided to give the go ahead because I know the car and it is reliable.

Today, they phoned me and told me they sent the cylinder head off for skimming but the bloke who was doing it was adamant that the head gasket was fine and wasn't leaking!

The garage said it was now concerning where the leak was coming from which I thought was strange as surely you would be 100% certain before you started a major job and an expensive job like this.

So now I have to wait for them to put it all back together and try and find the leak again.

Not bring a confrontational person, has anyone an idea on where I stand with paying for work done to fix the leak but an incorrect diagnosis given and back to square one?

I did ask today could it be the IMG as I have searched on here but he came back with a 'no' straight away!

Thanks in advance for any advice.

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[Dorchester]

Here in France no major work should be done before a quote is made and accepted by the owner. If the garage doesn't comply with that rule it is faulty and the price asked debatable.

 

[gnu]

Yes it could have been the IMG. I've replaced these more often than HGs, and it's an easy job compared to HG. If there is any good news for you, they should replace the IMG when they put it back together (I always go for the thicker black type - see link). It could be the water pump leaking, are they replacing that? There are O rings on the thermostat and various pipes as well that could leak.

When similar happened to me with a bodged HG repair at a garage, I towed the car away as they said it needed a new engine for £1k+. I fixed the HG etc, drove it back to them and showed them a properly repaired HG. Payment wise, I did a deal with the garage and paid for the bought-in bits, but not labour. This was quite generous to them IMO, but a do-able deal. I have rarely used garages on MG-R's since.

R25 - IMG Replacement

Found another problem on my newly acquired Rover 25: the coolant level dropped and a look underneath revealed a drop of coolant under the sump. I had a good look around, including taking blind photos with the camera, and saw the IMG looked suspect with signs of leaking coolant. I...

www.mg-rover.org

 

[YasmineGotham]

it could of been the img, the head gaskets do leak if someone fits the wrong gasket type, but most garages don't check that, they just go straight to headgasket sadly,

 

[rfrancis475]

Thanks for all the advice. Think you're right, as soon as they see coolant loss on a Rover they just go straight for the head gasket. Shame really cause it shows their lack of knowledge!

The 25's not ready from the HG replacement till Friday and then they've got to find out where it actually is leaking from. Highly unlikely they will do the IMG as they have already said it's not that despite, as far as I am aware, not even looking...



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[rfrancis475]

Forgot to say, the water pump was replaced last HG change 9000 miles ago

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[YasmineGotham]

Forgot to say, the water pump was replaced last HG change 9000 miles ago

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i bet they used the wrong gasket, i see it all the time

 

[rfrancis475]

Bit of an update...

I have now paid for the work as it was completed yesterday. They have invoiced for head gasket replacement due to failure of head gasket. I needed my car back for important eye clinic appointments next week so had no option but to pay.


I queried this with them as when they updated me they said the third party they use for skimming said it didn't look like gasket failure. They replied with that although it didn't look like it the likelihood was that it was. A friend of mine says that head gasket failures only happen internally but my leak was or is external as coolant was found on the sump casing, not sure this is accurate as I know very little about cars! So this has still left me confused as to why they think the head gasket was leaking. I asked them prior to replacing if there was any water in the oil and coolant which they confirmed there wasn't.


They have asked me to visit them when I've done 200 miles of driving so they can check everything is ok. I will be going back earlier than that because they have not put back one of the three rocker cover bolts that were on there when I took it in!



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[Dorchester]

I cannot know anything about the real root of your problem, but the garage service looks rather poor. I suspect they proceeded rather by guesstimate (A Rover and the usual silly joke about the HGF) than by an qualified knowledge.

I'd recently experienced a possible HG problem on my 25: but I never had any external leak, just a loss of coolant, slight in the beginning then more important on the long term. But controlling coolant level every week & topping it only when necessary (waiting that it goes from max to min) I could wait... about 4 years!

And as said above the likely culprit might have been the IMG as well.

I asked my good & efficient mechanic to do the job because I was topping more and more coolant, the oil level was very slightly beginning to increase (proving that coolant was passing through in the oil), a little mayo began to be seen and that the problem should be fixed: no skimming was necessary, the head surface was mint, IMG, HG, EMG and the like were done and that's it.

Now levels are stuck to their best and the engine is working a treat.

 

[Man in the Car]

A friend of mine says that head gasket failures only happen internally but my leak was or is external as coolant was found on the sump casing

Your friend is wrong. External leakage from HGF is not as common as internal leakage, but does happen quite often nonetheless - usually from the front near the cam belt end of the head/block join (left side as you look into the engine bay from the front).

 

[gnu]

Bit of an update...

I have now paid for the work as it was completed yesterday. They have invoiced for head gasket replacement due to failure of head gasket. I needed my car back for important eye clinic appointments next week so had no option but to pay.


I queried this with them as when they updated me they said the third party they use for skimming said it didn't look like gasket failure. They replied with that although it didn't look like it the likelihood was that it was. A friend of mine says that head gasket failures only happen internally but my leak was or is external as coolant was found on the sump casing, not sure this is accurate as I know very little about cars! So this has still left me confused as to why they think the head gasket was leaking. I asked them prior to replacing if there was any water in the oil and coolant which they confirmed there wasn't.


They have asked me to visit them when I've done 200 miles of driving so they can check everything is ok. I will be going back earlier than that because they have not put back one of the three rocker cover bolts that were on there when I took it in!



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If it's all paid for and done, I'd put it down to experience and just monitor that it is fixed (no loss of coolant etc). If the bolt you are talking about is one in the three that holds the plastic coil/ spark plug cover, that could wait 200 miles so you can be more confident the 'HG' issue is fixed before returning to the garage for the check.

 

[rfrancis475]

Thanks as usual for all the helpful advice, just be the monitoring then for 200 miles and fingers crossed at all times!... Took it back this morning and asked about the bolt, he apologised and said he forgot to tell me about that, it's thread was knackered apparently, it sheared off as he was undoing it ...

My first car was an E reg Maestro back in 1993 and being young I never had it serviced or had the oil changed in 70,000 miles! It ran and ran and got through every MOT that I put it through for six years... Sold it on to a work colleague who was very happy with it. My ethos then was avoid garages like the plague, I seem to have lost that mentality at great expense!

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[HughmR]

I suggest that you check the core plugs [ welsh plugs] on the block. any seepage would result in coolant loss.

 

[gnu]

...

My first car was an E reg Maestro back in 1993 and being young I never had it serviced or had the oil changed in 70,000 miles! It ran and ran and got through every MOT that I put it through for six years... ..

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You were lucky.
(poor car )

 

[Man in the Car]

I suggest that you check the core plugs [ welsh plugs] on the block.

The K series doesn't have any (the OP hasn't specified the engine, but I assume it is a K?)

 

[rfrancis475]

Yep, 'tis a K series so no Welch plugs...

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[rfrancis475]

You were lucky.
(poor car )

It served me well even if I didn't do the same for it

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[rfrancis475]

Well, the level seems to be holding up but now I've got an ignition problem! Everything lights up, but nothing to the starter... Tried changing fuse 20 with a new 10 amp fuse, it cranked slightly and then nothing again. Tried another fuse but still nothing... It's now testing my patience in a Basil Fawlty kind of way!

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[Dorchester]

No sound at all even from the starter or no firing up?
How old is your battery? Did you check it?

 

[rfrancis475]

No sound at all even from the starter or no firing up?
How old is your battery? Did you check it?

Just had the breakdown people out, he checked the battery which was fine and then gave a wire a wiggle on the starter motor, hey presto, it starts again... Think he showed me the one with a spade connector on it for future reference but it was dark so not entirely sure if it was the one...

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