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Numbers dont lie HAM as made any other British driver look like no bodies. Dont matter what you think of him off track. Few more poles and wins he will be the most successful F1 driver in the sports history.... Thread closed :smile:
 

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rover_45
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Numbers dont lie HAM as made any other British driver look like no bodies. Dont matter what you think of him off track. Few more poles and wins he will be the most successful F1 driver in the sports history.... Thread closed :smile:
There are more GPs nowadays so the chances of being able to win more / get more poles is greater for him than those from the past. Like all of us he has good and bad points but when he has issues he certainly takes them to work with him although he does seem to be maturing.

The race I remember was one German GP where Hamilton had been close behind Schumy for lap after lap and Button breezed up behind them and went straight by them both.:surprise:
 

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The race I remember was one German GP where Hamilton had been close behind Schumy for lap after lap and Button breezed up behind them and went straight by them both.:surprise:

That was the Italian GP at Monza. Seem to recall Button had a longer top gear, so was better able to close up on them. Ham's was set up better for running in clean air (in regards getting up to top speed), but wasn't long enough when in a tow so hitting the rev limiter and maxed out on speed.


Seem to recall that was the year Ham was really off the rails, 2012 ??
 

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Numbers dont lie HAM as made any other British driver look like no bodies. Dont matter what you think of him off track. Few more poles and wins he will be the most successful F1 driver in the sports history.... Thread closed :smile:

Thread NOT closed.


Agreed he is the most successful British F1 driver to date (in total numbers), possibly will be of all time. However, Ham has only won ~29% of his races, Jimmy won ~34% of his. Jimmy was also on pole for ~45% of his races, Ham so far has only managed it 34% of the time.


"Great" and "successful" aren't the same thing. The OP's question was "greatest", not "most successful".




Brigadoon makes the point on opportunities to win (i.e. many more GPs these days), cars are loads more reliable these days, fewer cars with a genuine ability to win races (partly linked to previous point on reliability).




Don't forget the regularity with which driver's died in the 50s, 60s and 70s (what was the number from JYS' autobiog, something like 57 funerals attended in the 8 yrs he raced F1). Jimmy would surely have won many more races and titles (read their respective biogs, all of his peers felt inferior in comparison).


Those guys often raced in a whole load more classes too; non-championship F1 races, F2, F5000, Tasman, sports cars, touring cars WHILST also being F1 racers (so a great many more opportunities to meet their maker).


I know it's not purely the modern driver's decision, but you won't find a modern F1 driver racing/winning in e.g. Germany one weekend then piloting & winning in a Lotus Cortina (or modern BTCC equivalent) round Oulton Park the next.
 

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rover_45
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That was the Italian GP at Monza. Seem to recall Button had a longer top gear, so was better able to close up on them. Ham's was set up better for running in clean air (in regards getting up to top speed), but wasn't long enough when in a tow so hitting the rev limiter and maxed out on speed.


Seem to recall that was the year Ham was really off the rails, 2012 ??
Yes, you are correct it was just so daft that Button made it look so easy.
 

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classic_mg
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Discussion Starter #11
Interesting responses.

I'm glad you picked up on the fact i said greatest, not most successful. I suppose "greatest" is probably inherently a lot more subjective.

I admire the personality of Hamilton because I believe his success and his demeanour have helped somewhat in dragging the light back onto the F1 in the UK. I reckon it could be the legacy of drivers which ultimately determines whether they are the greatest. If Hamilton inspires the next generation of young, British drivers, that can surely only be testament to the stature of the man?

Also well aware he can be a divisive figure as this thread shows!
 

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Yes but why would a modern driver need to do that. You think how much training, fitness, sponsorship etc etc they have to do were would they have time to fit in other races it wouldn't be possible. Plus why would you if you were getting paid millions to do one job why do another be stupid. Those old drivers if was same age today wouldn't be able to handle the G force, speed etc a modern F1 car does today even Moss said in a interview when he was saying just by letting off the throttle a F1 car today provided over twice the force a old car could do under max braking.
 

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If he had the chance to get in Hamilton's car you could.


Oh, and also Alonzo too with the right car.
Quite agree. I feel Button is similar in some ways to the Late Tony Pond. The only realy competive car he got was the 6R4. And that got banned with all the other Group B beasts.
 

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Very difficult to objectively compare drivers (or any sports person) from different eras. The circuits have changed so much as have the cars and the tech that goes into them. Hundreds of engineers and strategists with countless computer hours these days. The driver is becoming a smaller and smaller part of the team. He is told when to push, when to ease up, when to pit etc. Won't be long now until the driver is another part of history. Hamilton is a good driver, very good, one of the greats possibly, (having the best car has never hurt either) but he does not have that last 0.5% that makes the outstanding ones. Lots of F1 world champions were not the best driver of their day but they had the best car or the best tyres or the best team etc. Hill (both of them) were not the greatest drivers of their day but they were good enough, in the right car at the right time to do the job. Will there be another Senna, probably but sadly we may not notice.
 

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classic_mg
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Discussion Starter #16
Quite agree. I feel Button is similar in some ways to the Late Tony Pond. The only realy competive car he got was the 6R4. And that got banned with all the other Group B beasts.
Very good point about Button. I mean he had an incredible car the year he won, but there's no doubt his success has been hindered by the manufacturers he has raced for over his career. Shame.

Would a season in which all drivers had the EXACT same car be interesting or boring i wonder? Would you still have some of the top players or would results be more spread out?
 

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ROVER 25 and a ROVER CABRIOLET
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Just wondering as he has ignored them in the past, one of the many
reasons why I lost interest in him.
 
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