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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok, i have had a slight leak ever since buying the car and the underside of the gearbox is covered. I have taken it to Rover and they said it was engine oil that had probably come down the timing belt side, run along the front of the sump and over the gearbox. They cleaned the front of the sump and said if it returns then it is running down from that side. Well it has come back but from the gearbox side.

After having enough, i wiped the bottom of the gearbox and smelt it, then the oil on the dipstick and it smelt completely different. Took the tissue up to my local garage and they smelt it and they said it was gearbox oil. Came home and someone in the know with motors also confirmed it was gearbox oil.

Apart from the driveshaft oil seal, which i have already ruled out as when i took it to Rover i looked underneath and it was bone dry. What else is there that side that could be leaking?

Any ideas anyone???
 

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Driveshaft oilseals would be the most likely source of the leak.

The other possibilities are ..

Filler bolt loose.

Input shaft oilseal, this would cause other problems, slipping clutch etc.

A leak from the speedometer transducer fitting point.


Have you checked to make sure that the gearbox hasn't been overfilled with oil?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Driveshaft oilseals would be the most likely source of the leak.

The other possibilities are ..

Filler bolt loose.

Input shaft oilseal, this would cause other problems, slipping clutch etc.

A leak from the speedometer transducer fitting point.


Have you checked to make sure that the gearbox hasn't been overfilled with oil?
Hi, thanks for replying :) I have physically seen the oil seal around the driveshaft on the n/s and it is bone dry.

The area around the filler bolt isn't really wet it looks more like where the oil has spread, if you know what i mean?

Input shaft oil seal, i don't even know where this one is, but, i have no problems with the clutch etc, drives just fine.

I've not checked where the speedo goes into the gearbox but will do when it stops raining again (just started again, just typical).

I must say though it looks more wet around the area under the drain bolt and there is always some drips appearing from that area even when wiped clean and the car not driven, more drips always appear. Suspect drain bolt?

Don't get me wrong it's not a major leak but it is leaving spots on the ground after being parked, it's just frustrating me more than anything really and would like to fix the problem.

Cheers for your help.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
And sorry to add, that i haven't checked the oil to see if it has been overfilled, i didn't really want to upset things down there before i got a rough idea of what the problem was.
 

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Mine car is a '96 coupe, with the R65 box - so should be the same as the 1.4 'bubble' Rovers.

However, I had the box replaced on mine (after too many racing starts) - so no idea what vintage my current box is.

Might be worth trying that end seal though - they are only 4 to 5 quid from a Rover dealer and easy to replace. I never got round to doing mine, as the belt failed first :(
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hi, after looking at me gearbox again today it does have similarities to your Dan but i don't think it is leaking around the black end piece as in your photo, my seal looks fine. Below are some pictures i have taken of the offending area if this helps anyone? Please give ideas of what you think it may be. Does anyone know how much either a new bolt would be for the drain plug or would i get a way with a new washer? I can't get too far under the car today as i'm suffering from having a wisdom tooth taken out today, so i'm in a bit of pain.

Cheers for everyone's help


 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Hi there just to add, that the main drips form on the bit of the gearbox that sticks out directly underneath the n/s driveshaft, just under the drain plug as in pic 4. But, oil also collects under the flywheel casing, (the bit with the hole underneath), the section i'm talking about can be seen in pics 2 and 3 better.

What looks like fresh oil is where i wiped it clean to see what the oil was, but weather permitting i will use some degreaser on it tomorrow. One question, which is better to use, brake cleaner or engine degreaser? As i have a can of each at my disposal. If i spray it on will it wash off with just a hose or will i have to get my pressure washer out?

Thanks for all your help.
 

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Hi, You have an R65 gearbox. These were/are notorious for leaking from the joint between the 2 main casings which seems to fit in with your problem. In fact, doing this job was very common whilst they were under warranty & kept us going! The job entails splitting the casings & resealing with silicone sealant which is obviously a gearbox out job.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Hi, You have an R65 gearbox. These were/are notorious for leaking from the joint between the 2 main casings which seems to fit in with your problem. In fact, doing this job was very common whilst they were under warranty & kept us going! The job entails splitting the casings & resealing with silicone sealant which is obviously a gearbox out job.
So it looks like it may not be a job i can do. Any idea how long and what sort of costs are involved in this job? From re-reading Technozen's ideas above, it has got me a bit worried about the input shaft oil seal, are these seals common for failing? One main question would also be, would it be ok to leave it dripping or must it be sorted?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Update

Cleaned of the old oil residue from under the gearbox and took it for a drive. I know don't believe it is coming from the drain filler bolt but from behind the lower cover on the bell housing as you can see in some new photos. The only problem now is i'm not 100% sure it is gearbox oil, as the oil that is appearing isn't the same colour as the gearbox oil i wiped off before, it looks more like engine oil now and it doens't have a strong aroma either. I am stumped. I'm going to take the lower cover off to see if i can see anything.

Please take a look at the photos and tell me what you think. I really feel reluctant to taking it to a garage as money is tight at the mo. Please help, Thanks.







Any help is much appreciated :)
 

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Ok, Obviously It's hard to tell from the pics but 2 things spring to mind. The first is to look above the gearbox - is a camshaft seal leaking & the oil running down the gearbox/engine joint usually by capillary action. The 2nd is that it may be either the rear crank seal or the sump gasket but to check will need the g/box out. Hope this helps, give me a shout if not - pity you don't live this way!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Thanks for replying again.

I took the cover off just below the flywheel and it was quite a mess. Cleaned all of this up and wiped into the bell housing (obviously without the engine running :eek:uch: ) and it was also quite filthy. Had the engine running for a good few minutes including revving abit and no oil came out from behind the flywheel so i'm guessing that the rear crankshaft seal is ok.

I have left the cover off over night to see if anything develops but it's been like it since 3 o'clock this afternoon and i have not found anymore drips, some would have normally developed by now. I checked at about 9 pm before it got too dark and nothing was there, so fingers crossed it will be the same in the morning.

I don't think the camshft seals are leaking as i haven't noticed any oil running down the side of the block.

I do know that my sump gasket tends to weap but i don't really want to tackle this at the mo as it looks too involved, but i know it will need sorting. This isn't too much of a problem at the mo as my oil level doesn't seem to be dropping.

I will be taking it one day at a time and see how things go but any other ideas or tips on solving any said problems.

Thanks a lot
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Update

Ok, i've left the car sitting over night and no more drips have occured ffrom the bottom of the bell housing so i think this must have been excess water from the cleaning running out of the bell housing (i hope).

But i have found where the gearbox oil is coming from and that is from between the two mating surfaces where the black bolts are in the picture below. Thanks '418sld' for spotting this earlier.

Now the question is, Is it definitely a gearbox out job to reseal or can i put anything along the joint to try and seal it? In both instances what type of sealant would i need?

What sort of timescale is this job as my father-in law builds kit cars so should be able to give me a hand and have any relevant tools which i don't have?

This isn't a major leak as it only seaps through the joint but obviously any leak isn't good so would like to get it sorted.

Thanks everyone for your help. :)

 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
UPDATE - So Far So Good

Had another look today and those block bolts in my previous post needed nipping up and i wiped it all clean and just as a preventative measure, have smeared some blue hylomar sealant on the joint and so far (touch wood X1000) it has not leaked a drop.

The oil coming down from the bell housing was (I think) from the sump gasket. The two bolts under the exhaust needed nipping up, quite a bit actually and so far again has only seaped a minor amount.

I did notice though that the bit of the sump gasket that hangs over the edge of the pan has a small split in it. I think the oil is coming from there as it only seems to leak that side, but would this tiny split be enough for it to leak? Hope that makes sense?

Thanks
 

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Wow! Looks like we're getting somwhere. It would be a 'box out job to reseal with instant gasket or similar, the only tricky bit is pulling 5th gear off the mainshaft. This is the only bit that really needs the special tool although if your pa-in-law is handy he may be able to make up somthing with a conventianal puller. If you decide to go ahead contact me via the message system & I'll e-mail the pages from the manual with some tips. Cheers, Steve
 

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Spray the whole of the engine, bell housing and gearbox undersides with some good engine degreasant. Then, powerfully jet wash off the underside until the whole is clean and crud free. After a few more miles with a clean area, any fresh oil appearing should be easy to identify where it's coming from. My local jet wash garage charges two quid for six minutes jet wash usage. Ideal for cleaning engines. I use Swarfega engine degreasant and apply it using a simple plant mist sprayer with adjustable nozzle ~ about a couple of quid from local garden centres**.

One other thing. Gearbox oil is normally cleaner than engine oil. When I drained the gearbox on my Montego which I had for over ten years (ARG state its filled for life ) ~ the oil came out as clean and clear as the day it left the production line. If the oil is dirty or black, chances are it's a leak from the engine ~ on the T16 rover engines, with high mileage the rear crank seal wears and allows engine oil to seep out via the bottom of the bell housing.

Unless you can positively identify the sources of the oil leaks, you risk fixing something that does not need doing...

** The engines on my cars are usually cleaner than the interiors! Hate working on a dirty engine .... I looked at a tidy Rover 620ti recently ~ a lady driver ~ nice clean interior and bodywork not bad considering car's age. However, the engine compartment was filthy and probably had never been cleaned since it left the factory .. actually I do not mind seeeing a car like that. You get a better idea of what could be wrong. Mind you, the engine oil was clean and clear indciating a recent change of engine oil ... always a favourable sign....:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thanks guys for replying it's much appreciated. I have just gone a checked under the car and have found no drips of gearbox or engine oil, which i'm taking as a good sign but not the difinitive outcome. I will be keeping an eye on the situation over the next few days and if anything more does occur then i will take you up on your offer '418sld' and maybe get it sorted. I hate having leaks, i bet everyone feels the same.

I will keep everyone updated on the situation over the next few days and re-post on this thread.

Thanks everyone for your help :) Keep your fingers crossed for me.
 
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