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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Good evening Everyone.
I am really hoping someone can shed a bit of light for me as I'm back to the MG world after not having one for a few years and hoping I haven't brought a dud. So I picked up a really nice condition 2009 TF today with only 30000 miles on the clock. Runs and drives like a dream. No overheating issues as hopefully with the N series engine I won't get them. However when I got home after a 100 mile drive noticed that engine bay fan was running . Noticed that it stayed on when driving to. However left the act idling for ages and although the engine bay fan kept running the rad fans didn't come on. The temp didn't move on the gauge and no over heating issues. I know on my old one the engine bay fan sensor was seperate and on the new Chinese ones it's linked , so anyone got any ideas..

Many thanks
 

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Rover V8 Marlin
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Hi I also have a 2009 MGTF and it does exactly what you describe with the fans. Engine bay cooling fan will run after a fast run and maybe continue for about 30 seconds after I've turned off the engine (that's maybe a good thing).
I've never heard the rad fans running (there are 2 of them). I've tested both rad fans and they run fine when connected directly to the battery. Somebody told me they will run on slow speed at times which probably wouldn't be heard, I can't confirm that however.
I've had similar worries to you but the car has never failed and runs great. From what I've learnt the N series engine has modified away the head gasket problems but time will tell, mines done 18500 miles. I would keep an eye on things, and make sure the coolants been renewed at the correct intervals. If not I would get the coolant changed. My coolant header tank cap showed signs of coolant stains around it but to be fair the new does exactly the same. Renew the cam belt as specified and enjoy the car. They are good cheap fun. Based on my experiences I don't think you have any problems
 

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'10 TF135
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leethomp1 please can I draw your attention to a thread on p3 of MGF Register forum entitled 'TF 135 2009 - OBD2 Connection' by Basil?

In short some of us with SAIC TF135 models have experienced some surprises :- 'checksum error' when looking at engine fault codes, 'sensitive' fan, faster tickover, difficulty in resetting the oil service countdown etc. This thread shares some of our experiences, one of which you mention. The 'villain of the peace' seems to be the different engine control unit that's used in the SAICs.

I doubt that you've bought a 'dud'; we seem to expect the last TFs made by MGMotors (as opposed to MGRover) to behave the same as they've always done - but there are differences! Imo you're more aware of them when you've owned an earlier version.

ps your front fans are very quiet compared to the noisy rear - I bet you'll find they're running too! I'm pretty certain the fans are not independent; they all work together, controlled by the ecu. But rest assured, that pesky fan can be tamed 🙄
 

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MG TF 135
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Hi leethomp1

I had exactly same issue on a SAIC MG TF, but only after I had a remap. It behaved fine up to that point but immediately after I could hear the engine bay fan running as soon as engine was up to normal temperature. The only fault code was a checksum error on the ECU when OBD2 scanned. Chinese (Continental) ECU is locked and does not like people poking about. Only meant to be used on 1 engine. The British (Motorola) ECU was intended to be flashed with different maps for different engines 1.4/1.6/1.8. Streetwise to TF. Can be poked about.

There have been many threads over the last few months on the issue and I believe there are only 2 relatively simple solutions, both require Pscan tool.

First is to buy a new Continental MEMS3 ECU part No NNN000830, that is what is in your car now, and match it to your car using Pscan. ECU £99 Ebay.

Second is to buy a second hand Motorola MEMS3 ECU off a British MG TF 1.8 non vvc, Part Number NNN100743, and match that to your car using Pscan. ECU £30- £70 Ebay

I did the second method, and at the same time loaded a SAWS performance map with Pscan. All good, no more fans, no errors.

Cheers Mark
 

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Regularly I monitor, record and analyse live data (using Pscan) which includes the engine and radiator fans. You will be surprised how little they come on. Never on a fast run but when climbing up hills, ambient engine and water temperatures rise quickly and then the fans kick in. Even though the car and sensors are 23 years old, they come on when they should and they go off when they should (basically when the engine is under load). The engine fan rarely if ever kicks in as set at a high-temperature threshold.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks all for your advise. Put my mind at rest a bit. It's going in to mg specilaist on Tuesday for cambelt and water pump so might ask them if they can do anything
Thanks again
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hi leethomp1

I had exactly same issue on a SAIC MG TF, but only after I had a remap. It behaved fine up to that point but immediately after I could hear the engine bay fan running as soon as engine was up to normal temperature. The only fault code was a checksum error on the ECU when OBD2 scanned. Chinese (Continental) ECU is locked and does not like people poking about. Only meant to be used on 1 engine. The British (Motorola) ECU was intended to be flashed with different maps for different engines 1.4/1.6/1.8. Streetwise to TF. Can be poked about.

There have been many threads over the last few months on the issue and I believe there are only 2 relatively simple solutions, both require Pscan tool.

First is to buy a new Continental MEMS3 ECU part No NNN000830, that is what is in your car now, and match it to your car using Pscan. ECU £99 Ebay.

Second is to buy a second hand Motorola MEMS3 ECU off a British MG TF 1.8 non vvc, Part Number NNN100743, and match that to your car using Pscan. ECU £30- £70 Ebay

I did the second method, and at the same time loaded a SAWS performance map with Pscan. All good, no more fans, no errors.

Cheers Mark
Mark,

How difficult is it To do this. I'm mechanically minded rather than computer and electrics.
Also where do I get the Pscan from. Or cheekily asking is this something that you could for me and I would gladly pay you for time .
Kind regards
 

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MG TF 135
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Hi leethomp1

Quite easy, just follow the on screen prompts.

Pscan is an ODD2 interface for a laptop available from www.pscan.uk if no-one near you has one to buy up with.

I would say taking old one out, fitting replacement ECU and pairing it with pscan would take 20 minutes.

Cheers, Mark
 

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'10 TF135
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A little bit more than markvrs' prices which I can I can personally verify.

Your SAIC ecu is NNN000830. There are a very few used ones about but in my experience they'll expect you to buy the scu/alarm 'box' and key fobs thus doubling or trebling the price. This is so that everything 'talks', the car starts and you can lock/unlock it because it's the whole package that worked the donor car. Or you can buy new and TF 135 mapped...

The (older) MGR ecu is NNN100743. You can buy this new and TF135 mapped for much the same price but why not 'used'? There's plenty of them about; look also for a smaller extra label (not shown on your pic) that has 'NNW' on it. That way it should be a TF135 unit that's already be mapped for your TF135.

In both cases you'll need an amateur with PScan or a prof with 'T4' (I think it is...) to synch the ecu to your current scu/alarm unit + fobs, so that you don't have to buy these too, to be able to get into and start your car.

With the ecu you've found you wouldn't need PScan to synch it to your current alarm/scu/fobs anyway, since it's a 'plug 'n play'. You'd have to send your ecu away to them and they'll 'activate' it instead..

Hope this helps...
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Arnty,
I'm very confused now. So if I order an older ECU of that company and send mine to them then they will copy mine and on return should work fine with my locks alarms etc..
Bit if I buy a second hand one myself I will have to use Pscan to programme it.
Is that right ??

Does anyone know of anyone that lives in the Bedfordshire area that would be willing to help me if they have a PScan.i would gladly pay for their time and hel


Many thanks again all
 

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MG TF 135
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Be wary if you buy a plug and play as they may just have disabled the immobiliser so you do not have to pair it. Security and insurance issue. If they just copy yours you may well have the same issue if it is a software problem (likely)

I bought pscan and ebay MEMS3 ecu for £200. Cheaper than the link posted for plug and play ecu. And pscan is an excellent tool if you plan on keeping the car.
 

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Hi leethomp1. I'm sorry to confuse you...but you're completely right :)

You'll probably get a stock TF135 map on a used NNN100743 unit that will bolt straight on to your TF and work straight away (like your pic) for your £239.99

If you buy an ecu (like markvrs') second hand yourself, either a pal with PScan will 'do it for a pal' (as many would...) or a Pro with MGR/SAIC diagnostics will charge you to synch it to your car so that it'll work as you expect.

You have to 'balance your own books' - as markvrs has - so I've tried to tell you all the alternatives (for now) that we know of (...but if you don't have to buy PScan you'll be saving straight away...)

Nearly 3years ago I was in the same position as you. There was no advice and I 'chose' to pay £349 for a sportier used remapped ecu like 'yours' to get my car back on the road. My SAIC ecu was diagnosed as 'broken' by two different specialists.

I wouldn't do it the same way now, as markvrs has shown you (thanks for the figures markvrs (y)) - and he's given sound advice imo about the disabling of the immobiliser which some track enthusiasts like to do for their own 'ecu swap between cars convenience'. PScan won't disable your immobiliser, it'll learn your system instead)

Please share info on your choice; I'm sure it'll help those SAIC folk who might be beginning to realise that they're in the same position as you - especially as the weather warms up again.
 

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I am perhaps a bit late to the discussion but my 2009 model is the same - the engine fan will come during normal driving and run for 20 seconds or so after I stop the engine. Not always though - it didn’t do it this morning but it was a short smooth run in relatively low air temperature. It will come on if stuck in traffic.
 

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Hi Quesa.

Yes, someone once said to me 'they all do it' regarding the sensitive fan. I didn't believe it at the time esp since two ecu professionals told me that my ecu was broken and couldn't be fixed*.

It'd be interesting to do an OBD scan on yours to see if 'checksum error' is a fault log - since both seem to go hand-in-hand. If you can do that I'd really value the feedback**

3years ago sensitive fan, hot running, checksum error and higher tickover took most of the pleasure out of my new SAIC TF 135 ownership and I looked for a solution.

If sensitive fan/checksum error bothers you:-

1. An 'upgrade' remap (I know SAWS + Kmaps do them...) onto an older MGR NNN100743 Motorola ecu will solve the problem. -This was my original fix; very expensive at the time. Currently PScan/SAWS makes it a self-help solution and much less costly. My SAIC ecu was replaced by a used, standalone, earlier '743 from a tuner. He implied these earlier ecus were 'less fragile'
2. A used older MGR TF 135 ecu (Motorola NNN100743 seems the one...) should work but it may (as far as I can find out) have a less specific (non - TF 135) map on it. If there's any doubt check the with the seller that the donor ecu has a stock TF135 map, so you're certain...see the earlier post, a fellow SAIC forum member has recently upgraded his by remapping with a different tuner.
3. A brand new SAIC NNN000830 ecu (made by Continental) I know will work and the fan and temperature control behaves 'as it should', and particularly like a non-SAIC TF135, with no 'checksum error' and a slightly lower tickover.
4. A brand new (also Continental made now) NNN100743 should work. I haven't tried this but it is an older non-EU4 TF 135 design - the SAIC '830 ecu replacement could claim EU4 status for the new owner, MGMotors. (Anyway, why bother paying the same price for an older design?)

We've found out that SAIC ecus cannot be remapped w/out being opened up and 'operated on'; older Motorola MGR units can be remapped relatively simply through the OBD port, so this method is favoured. (It might be that only the Motorolas - and not the Continentals - can be 'poked about' as markvrs mentioned.)

In all these solutions we've used PScan (a diagnostic tool that many forum-ers are using - but I gather T4 will work in the hands of a Pro...) to synch/learn the recipient ecu to the current immobiliser. This is the key; PScan enables the correct donor ecu to synch to your existing immobiliser.

Sorry, but I rather suspect that your fan will come on sooner and longer as our weather warms up.

*Currently it can be put right if you have a PScan (or a pal with one) - unless you're happy with 'they all do that'

**It's never 'a bit late to the discussion'. Thanks, because your experience seeds another confirmation of SAIC difference and spreads the word...
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Hi Quesa.

Yes, someone once said to me 'they all do it' regarding the sensitive fan. I didn't believe it at the time esp since two ecu professionals told me that my ecu was broken and couldn't be fixed*.

It'd be interesting to do an OBD scan on yours to see if 'checksum error' is a fault log - since both seem to go hand-in-hand. If you can do that I'd really value the feedback**

3years ago sensitive fan, hot running, checksum error and higher tickover took most of the pleasure out of my new SAIC TF 135 ownership and I looked for a solution.

If sensitive fan/checksum error bothers you:-

1. An 'upgrade' remap (I know SAWS + Kmaps do them...) onto an older MGR NNN100743 Motorola ecu will solve the problem. -This was my original fix; very expensive at the time. Currently PScan/SAWS makes it a self-help solution and much less costly. My SAIC ecu was replaced by a used standalone '743 from a tuner. He said these earlier ecus were 'less fragile'
2. A used older MGR TF 135 ecu (Motorola NNN100743 seems the one...) will work but it may (as far as I can find out) have a less specific (to TF 135) map on it. If there's any doubt check the donor car and/or remap the unknown/questionable ecu with a stock TF135 map so you're certain...I've done this and a fellow SAIC forum member has recently upgraded his by remapping with a different tuner.
3. A brand new SAIC NNN000803 ecu (made by Continental) will work and the fan behaves 'as it should' and particularly like a non-SAIC TF135 with no 'checksum error' and a slightly lower tickover. I've done this too...
4. A brand new Continental NNN100743 should work. I haven't tried this but it is an older non-EU4 TF 135 design - the SAIC '830 ecu replacement
could claim EU4 status for the new owner, MGMotors. (Anyway, why bother paying the same price for an older design?)

We've found out that SAIC ecus cannot be remapped w/out being opened up and 'operated on'; older Motorola MGR units can be remapped relatively simply through the OBD port, so this method is favoured.

In all these solutions we've used PScan (a diagnostic tool that many forum-ers are using - but I gather T4 will work in the hands of a Pro...) to synch/learn the recipient ecu to the current immobiliser.

Sorry, but I rather suspect that your fan will come on sooner and longer as our weather warms up.

*Currently it can be put right if you have a PScan (or a pal with one) - unless you're happy with 'they all do that'

**It's never 'a bit late to the discussion'. Thanks, because your experience seeds another confirmation of SAIC difference and spreads the word...
Arnty,
The wife has kindly said she will buy me a PSCAN for my birthday in a couple of weeks.
I shall source an older ECU.
Once I have the equipment would you possibly be able to provide a guide on how to sort the issue and reprogramme the replacment ECU ??
 

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Hi leethomp, of course, but most of the process has already been outlined in the various posts above.

As far as I'm aware markvrs very recently pioneered this PScan/SAWS obd checksum/fan fix using an 'old model' MGR NNN100743 for his SAIC TF135. Certainly he was one of the first (if not the first). While he was doing this I took another option by merely PScan-ing a new Continental NNN000830 ecu onto mine - having used (for the last ~3years) a remapped MGR NNN100743 (ie from well before the recent PScan/SAWS initiative) as my only option..

But while you wait for your 'pressy' you might wish to visit the PScan w/s to get the general picture then follow up with a trip to the SAWS w/s to narrow down on the specifics.

(Cor...wish my other half was so supportive 😀...)
 

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Hi leethomp1,

Happy to run through it with you when you have all the bits. Have done exactly what you intend doing.

Cheers, Mark
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Hi leethomp1,

Happy to run through it with you when you have all the bits. Have done exactly what you intend doing.

Cheers, Mark
Thank you Mark..

Once I have everything I will let you know. Thanks all for your help
 
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